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Too few players to play 3-5-2 (SW and WB)
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  1. Too few players to play 3-5-2 (SW and WB)

    I have always loved 3-5-2 formations,and in older CMs (like 01-02) these formations were very succesfull. However in latest versions these tactics seem to NEVER work, maybe because they were obsolete by modern football as well. (however let's not forget that Brazil won it's last WC base on a 3-5-2) At this version (FM13) a formation that includes a SW,2 DC and 2 WB seems to be working great. However there are too few players that can play SW or WB. (but the problem is most with sweepers). That is in contrast with real life, as almost every player that plays the role of cover central defender could play sweeper. For example why can't Pique play sweeper as a natural position? Does anyone doubt thet he would play there or in a Libero position very easily?Or Rio Ferdinand? Examples are hundrends. Same thing also happens with Wingbacks. I hope in next versions SI will improve this. What do you think?
    Last edited by kostasq; 02/12/2012 at 11:56 PM.

  2. well unfortunately Im very conservative in this. My mind will not let me use 3 or 5 in the back, it just feels wrong :p just 4 guys in the back and last years wingbacks may be more offensive in my tactics.
    I think you should also ask how much gets player's performance lowered. I mean when the player has right attributes it is not so bad if he plays for him unknown position. Some players have only MC position, but they play pretty good when you put them on AMC or DMC (depends on attributes and roles of course). So if there is not drastic difference between CB and SW there shouldn't be big problem for that player to play this position/role

  3. you are right stajnko. Also versatility would show how capable a player is but it is a hidden attribute. However it is not great to put a DC as a SW and getting the red light. It is just not true in real football. Almost all central defenders are competent as sweepers

  4. I dont think you need to play with a SW and WBs you can get the same results by playing a flat back 3 or back 5... Just change the instructions ... In last years game I took the AC Milan job because I was offered it I decided to play Ancelottis 41212 because thats how Milan use to play... I started noticing the way I set it up it morphed into a 3-4-3 when I was attacking my DM (Yann M'Vila) played just slightly infront of the two CB's and my FBs (whose roles were WB (a)) pushed high up the pitch to provide width and essentially became Wingers... My AMC use to push right up beside my Strikers... Anyway what Im getting at is with the right instructions you can make it work the same...
    Mine was so successful Iv transitioned to that style I start with a 4231, it then moves to 41212 and eventually It becomes 3412 playing with an AMC is the only thing consistent in my tactics...with the 41212 I set my DM to DLP and pretty much what happens is he becomes the Libero and if you read some stuff on modern tactics that is something which has become a trend certain players who would have made a Libero have become DLPs M'Vila is a prime example IMO...
    I think you will be surprised how well a flat system works when you just change things a bit although this year they may have changed it I havnt had a chance to play my 3412... I should add my 41212 was incredibly successful and while the 3412 was very strong too at times it was flimsy... I hammered Barca 7-0 with the 3412 but in the net game OM killed me a similar thing happened when I played M'Vila as a CB he worked perfectly as a Libero did everything I wanted and ran the show this worked for about 5 or 6 games until I played Parma (who were pretty poor) and M'Vila got found out I persisted with him until a third goal flew in (his second mistake) I had to change it up checked the analysis my god he was dreadful...
    Just try a few things out Im sure you will find something that works... And if you're a small/medium team Terranova and Meteos are two natural SWs...
    Last edited by CDXtreme; 03/12/2012 at 03:19 AM.

  5. Just retrain them to SW. It's really not a big deal, same as playing guy in position he's not trained in for a while, he'll do just fine. In my recent game, I've regen striker (big, slow guy, great technically, and kind of creative, with plays with back to goal ppm), I play him in AMC slot, which is red dotted for him (I don't want to retrain him till, he reach most of his potential), and he's one of my best performers, having 1 goal, 11 assists in 23 EPL games, averaging 7,5 (he's rated 2,5 star for my nottingham forest, 3rd season).
    What I'm trying to say is, as long as player have good stats to play there, he'll perform.

  6. I will try, because for now I always try to get boccheti who's contract expires in the end of 1st year.i will take a look at terranova and Meteos as CDXtrme proposed
    CDXtreme likes this.

  7. Brazil is full of decent to great wing backs mate.

  8. Just play a flat back three - possibly with the player you want to use as sweeper set to 'cover'. The sweeper role as it used to be known was made obsolete by the change in the offside rule.

    The lack of decent wing-backs is more odd, I've never had a problem finding them. I play in Brazil in my current save and I'm actually having a problem finding a full back that isn't a D/WB. My best sides usually have a balance with a flying wing-back on the left and an Ivanovic-type D(RC) on the right.

  9. However I beieve that FM13 is the revenge of 3-4-1-2 lovers. I have tested various formations, all with Aston Villa, and 3-4-1-2 is the only that works (I have cheated a bit by editing Clark to play as a SW). You get a solid defense, very good for the set pieces, and also you get an AMC working behind 2 strikers (DLF and AF) which are just LETHAL. Also there are out of contract players like Drenthe and van den Borre who fit perfectly in the wingback attack position. If you sell some dead wood and pay the 4mm release clause of Welington Nem,playing behind Gabby and Bent you get a Europe qualification team . I have also tried flat 4-4-2, 4-1-2-2-1, 4-2-3-1, 4-4-2 with AML,AMR, 4-3-3 with 3 strikers (like in FM12) everything. I had success only with 3-4-1-2

  10. MANUMAD,Spleen, as I said, my problem is more with the SW position and less with the WB. And I do understand that you can find players to buy, but I do believe that almost all fb should be at least accomplished as wb (as the seem to be naturall when you put them as wb at the DL/DR position!) and also that the cover stoppers to be accomplished as SW, so you can start a team and employ this system right away. As I said, this is something that in real football happens! Spleen, I don;t think that the teams who play 3-5-2 use the offside rule, one of the defenders drops deep.
    Anyway thank you all for the feedback

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