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Life long fan about to rage quit football manager... for good
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  1. Life long fan about to rage quit football manager... for good

    I have owned and played every single football manager since championship manger 92-93 on floppy disk. I was 8 when I started. My favourite game, I loved it, I would spend hours after hours taking 3rd division teams to the top of the premiership. I had a formula, the search system was much simpler back then, you could choose from like 8 attributes to search for, stuff like flair, shooting etc. What I would do is by all young players with high creativity and flair.

    It worked, after some time I would have a top class team, players would regularly get sold abroad (that was a big thing back then) and I would win league and european competition. No matter how many leagues I won in never got boring. Also there were the super players that you would work out after playing A LOT. I can't remember them all but one I can remember is..... Anthony Bird. Anyone who played 92-93 like me will remember anthony bird. You could sign him for any club..... for cheap...... and he would play and score like ronaldo.

    My point is it was just so fun. Tons of replay value.

    In 2013 we have the most complicated version of championship / football manager ever released. You can appoint directors of football. You can talk to your players. You can interact with the board like never before. Complete 3d match engine. Does everything.

    There is one thing however, it does not seem to do. It does not make any sense. This applies to the last football manager as well.

    I really only enjoy playing lower league teams and trying to go for the whole career thing, however I cannot get past two or three seasons in this because it is so infuriatingly un fun to play now because of one thing. The slump that makes no sense. It is not even a slump, in my case it is a complete u - turn. From unbeatable. To unable to get a shot on target, and unable to get a clean sheet, no matter who you play.

    Now I know most people are going to read this and just be like, your using wrong tactics.... or.... your players arent good enough, or whatever. But I swear I have everything and it is not even about turning it around, it is just the complete change in form is unrealistic.

    In my new game I started as Brighton. First season as usual I created a new tactic, tailored everything including all of the individual settings for all my players to suit there strengths and weaknesses. It didn't work, was something like 4-1-2-2-1, but they just didn't play well. So I changed to a 442 using AMR/L rather then MR/L. I set back line to defend deeper and play more counter attacking football. Brighton have a lot of technically gifted players, so I set them to play a kind of short passing game. I also do not use long shots so they get better chances at goal.

    It worked. And boy did it work. The first game with the new formation was a win. It moved us out of relegation to 18th in the championship. We got the message saying that 'The manager changed his tactics and won (basically'. We then went on a straight 11 game winning streak. We beat everyone, played good football and scored loads of goals. Teams didn't get near us. We went up to second.

    Now up until this point it makes sense, I found a formation that worked for my team right? I struggled at first, but I twigged it. I thought promotion was a certainty. I could not have been more wrong. So the 12th game we drew. We then started drawing a bit and winning the odd game. Then eventually it was just predominantly draws, this seems to happen in all of the recent FM games. No matter what I do tactically, we could not hold a lead. In the end we managed to win the odd game, draw most and loase the odd game. The last 8 games were really bad though and we ended up finishing 4th.

    We lost play offs. However I could tell the point when it all changed was that 12th game, it was completely obvious from watching the games before and after that point that a switch had literally been pressed that completely changed our teams play. It was literally overnight.

    SO next season, started full of optimism. We were expected to gain promotion. We were even touted as possible title challenegers. I thought the season break might help reset the bad form. The season before I didn't buy one player, I loaned one, but didn't buy any. I spent the whole season scouting and researching players who would help lift the team. I invested in quality scouts with 17+ ratings for judging PA and CA. I only bought players who were consistently rated by 3 or more scouts as being 4 star. In total I made 4 or 5 major signings and about 4 or 5 19 or under players for the future. I spent 11 million.

    I was sacked within 2-3 months. We couldn't do anything and it got worse and worse. The same formation and style that won 11 games in a row with stronger players went from being unbeatable to not being able to create a chance, not being able to score a goal and never hold a lead. I think if I got back 10 or 15 games from the last season we had not kept a clean sheet in maybe 20-30 games in a row.

    I didn't quit there. Although I think it unrealistic and stupid, I thought it must be the formation. personally I think that kind of extreme change in performance does not make any sense, a bad game here or there, sure. Players being tired and making mistakes, of course. But from 2nd and unbeatable to sacked, in 30 games, doesn't make sense. It also means that as a manager you cannot really have a style. I put so much time in developing a formation and style that I thought would work and it did spectacularly, so to have to change the entire thing for what seems to be no reason does not make sense to me.

    Anyway, as I said I didn't quit there. I went back about 8 games. I tried about 8 different formations. Ones like:

    FM13. The Pav Tactic Thread. 442, 433, 451 (all 3)

    JP Woody's Simple & Solid 442 (13.1.3) - Downloads - Football Manager 2013 Tactics, Wonderkids & Cheats

    Might and Magic™ by Raikan007 Fm13 - Downloads - Football Manager 2013 Tactics, Wonderkids & Cheats

    Awesome 4-3-3; Loads of Goals - Downloads - Football Manager 2013 Tactics, Wonderkids & Cheats

    I also made up some more. Nothing worked. I had the same wingers as last season. The same star striker. The same 'Team of the Season' Goalkeeper. The captain in the center of midfield was their last season. All the players added were vast improvements. 4 star rated all of them.

    It is not just fun anymore. There needs to be a way out. I am not asking for automatic promotion, but it was obvious the exact moment it all just changed to absolute shit. Surely that is super unrealistic, surely if you were going to go from second to relegation zone it would be a gradual thing? Or at least like you have 10 of your first team players injured. How can all your players just stop performing overnight, for over a season.

    So after being sacked for the tenth time as Brighton I think I am quitting the game. It was exactly the same for FM2012 when I tried playing with a league 2 team. I think they need to look at this in the mechanics of the game because the dramatic change does not allow you to establish a style or favoured formation. Which is non sensical because all real managers favour a formation a style and try to get their teams to play with them consistently.

    If anyone agrees with me, has some suggestions, has a actual wonder formation, wants any more information on my team, or wants to slag me off for whining and not being good at the game, please post a reply here. I love this game so much and I just cant play it anymore. I have been playing the series for 20 years. I have actually lost relationships over my time spent playing it. I have sat and played for 16 hours straight before. I am a real fan. But it just is not fun for me anymore.

    Sorry for the long message just had enough and needed to vent my frustrations and cry out to the community for help. If you include FM2012 I have this experience nearly everytime I have tried to manage a lower league team and I just cannot see a light at the end of the tunnel. Rant finished.
    BobbyMoore, MMEE, CDXtreme and 1 others like this.

  2. I do agree with you to a degree but you cannot just change tactics in mud season and expect results. I use jp woodys 4-4-2 which got me the championship title in my first season. Yeah I lost the odd game and I went through patches of draws, losses and the odd win but you need to praise players when their doing well, keep confidence sky high, etc etc. I beat arsenal 2-1 in the league and man united 6-2 in the fa cup fourth round "for the fans"

    Stick at the game and just play for fun like I do, I have a championship title, fa cup and sitting top of group D in the europa league.
    OoscotsmanoO and corach1992 like this.

  3. Quote Originally Posted by Loud Metal Wolf View Post
    I do agree with you to a degree but you cannot just change tactics in mud season and expect results. I use jp woodys 4-4-2 which got me the championship title in my first season.
    If you said that to me Id probably lose the plot... You may have misread his post too because he did change his tactics (from a 433 to a 442) and did get results...

    I understand entirely what he is saying Iv had it myself but nowhere near as extreme as what he had...

    My advice is have three similar but different styles and use them accordingly for instance I use a 4231 Control almost always but I have a 4411 defensive/counter I use when Im wary of the others team attack (usually in away games) and my third tactic is usually something Im working on that adds more variation to my style Il that in some games to see how its working...
    Now people here say that teams learn your style and make changes to combat this I dont necessarily believe this because these slumps use to happen to me last year but nobody here ever mentioned them as far as I can tell... If the computer is learning your tactics this year I would argue that it did last year because patterns seemed to emerge like you describe...
    What I think actually happens is teams adopt their style based on your reputation and match events (I know some posters here have said it makes changes based on the match; I agree)...
    Now I dont know how much of the match you actually watch but when Im using a new tactic I watch full matchs until it starts working (so I can tweak things)... After this I will put it on key or extended and if my team isnt doing enough I switched to comprehensive to see whats wrong... By now you may have guessed Im going to suggest you watch full games or comprehensive once you feel you are entering a slump... This is probably the best advice I can give you because if you're watching the game and cant see where you're going wrong you should probably give up FM because IMO thats what you need to do to keep your team firing on all cylinders...

    Just so you can take my advice seriously I am in 2017 with Cordoba I have brought them from Liga Adelante all the way to the summit of La Liga... I have had many struggles on the way including a similar issue you had in my first season I made a 41221 based on possession but it didn work I switched to counter because my team could not defend and ended up winning the league but hit a slump towards the end... Second season I would have finished in the champions league spots only for a massive dip in form which took me 9 games to sort out I ended up 7th with only 4 wins in my last 15 games...
    It wasnt until my third season that I actually practised what I preached and watched games and made mid game changes.. I had another similar end of season crash but it was nowhere near as catastrophic this time as I was prepared and managed to avoid disaster I finished 3rd... Now in my 5th season with three trophies in the bag (but not the league) I have only lost two league games all season with 6 left and I am 1 point behind Madrid in first and my success is due in no small part to my analysis during matches that arnt going my way and making changes to ensure I win or prevent a loss...

    Below is the last screenshot I took of my league table (Iv played 32 games now) and an example of craziness...

    Life long fan about to rage quit football manager... for good-liga-bbva_-overview-stages.pngLife long fan about to rage quit football manager... for good-athletic-v-c-rdoba_-stats-match-stats.png
    Last edited by CDXtreme; 11/12/2012 at 03:32 AM.

  4. I feel your pain buddy. This is the worst FM they have made and yes I have played since the early cm 92-93 and totally agree.

    Your always going to have people say your doing it wrong, I don't lose etc..
    MMEE likes this.

  5. Mike.'s Avatar Mike.
    Manchester United Super Moderator
    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevaldo09 View Post
    I feel your pain buddy. This is the worst FM they have made and yes I have played since the early cm 92-93 and totally agree.

    Your always going to have people say your doing it wrong, I don't lose etc..
    Those people would be correct, bugs aside.

    The fact that someone has been playing for X amount of time, doesnt suddenly make the game rubbish.
    Fatal548 likes this.

  6. Quote Originally Posted by Mike. View Post
    Those people would be correct, bugs aside.

    The fact that someone has been playing for X amount of time, doesnt suddenly make the game rubbish.
    It is not about the game being rubbish. It is a good game. It is just the mechanics do not make sense to me. I have had some good advice, the guy saying to watch the whole game, I am going to try that because I only watch extended highlights.

    However I think people miss the point, I had a successful formation, my team one 11 games in a row. The same formation and we are in the relegation zone within 30 games and I am sacked. That to me does not make sense and has made the game a lot less fun to play.
    CDXtreme likes this.

  7. I agree with OP. Yeah I normally laugh at these type threads. But this year it is just silly it's not about the tactics It's all about saying the "correct" things at half time or after the game to the players there is far too much emphasis on this. The game is just random it makes no sense this year. Like you, I have used good tactics from good players but the results are just silly. I also had QPR finish 2nd and Arsenal nearly got relegated. I am selling my FM13 if anyone is interested? I'm going to load up one of the older FM's maybe FM2010 or FM2007 they were much better.

  8. gogogo golem
    Liverpool and Macclesfield Follows: Leicester City Modern Day Legend
    #8
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyMoore View Post
    I agree with OP. Yeah I normally laugh at these type threads. But this year it is just silly it's not about the tactics It's all about saying the "correct" things at half time or after the game to the players there is far too much emphasis on this. The game is just random it makes no sense this year. Like you, I have used good tactics from good players but the results are just silly. I also had QPR finish 2nd and Arsenal nearly got relegated. I am selling my FM13 if anyone is interested? I'm going to load up one of the older FM's maybe FM2010 or FM2007 they were much better.
    Second hand FMs are useless as the steam code can only be used once.

  9. Mike.'s Avatar Mike.
    Manchester United Super Moderator
    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by teknotel View Post
    It is not about the game being rubbish. It is a good game. It is just the mechanics do not make sense to me. I have had some good advice, the guy saying to watch the whole game, I am going to try that because I only watch extended highlights.

    However I think people miss the point, I had a successful formation, my team one 11 games in a row. The same formation and we are in the relegation zone within 30 games and I am sacked. That to me does not make sense and has made the game a lot less fun to play.
    It makes sense straight away. Did you keep your players focused, did you adapt to the opposition? Were you proactive enough? Off the bat I would say that you were simply outmanouvered.

  10. Mike.'s Avatar Mike.
    Manchester United Super Moderator
    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyMoore View Post
    I agree with OP. Yeah I normally laugh at these type threads. But this year it is just silly it's not about the tactics It's all about saying the "correct" things at half time or after the game to the players there is far too much emphasis on this. The game is just random it makes no sense this year. Like you, I have used good tactics from good players but the results are just silly. I also had QPR finish 2nd and Arsenal nearly got relegated. I am selling my FM13 if anyone is interested? I'm going to load up one of the older FM's maybe FM2010 or FM2007 they were much better.

    Actually this year its very much about the tactics, moreso than ever before. But you still have to manage the players. Football has never just been about the set ups, its the footballers as well, on and off the pitch. Its far from random, with all due respect. If it was then people would not be having systematic success would they. And yet many people are. So bugs/issues aside they probably are doing some thing or somethings right that you are not doing.
    Last edited by Mike.; 11/12/2012 at 06:46 PM.

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