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Player mistakes - This is out of hand
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  1. Player mistakes - This is out of hand

    since I got back from holiday and had not played Fm13 in over a month, I decided to start my 2nd favourite save, Spurs..

    Now developing new tactics (not using my old ones) I set out to create a few tactics that I can use depending on certain situations, opposition, competitions etc..

    While watching the games on comprehensive while tweaking my tactics I noticed something really, really worrying.. The amount of mistakes my defenders (and players) were making..

    You can say that settings/opposition etc are to blame, I can agree with that to a degree, however, most of the time my players would pass the ball straight back to the opposition and end up 1v1 with my keeper and the worst part, completely missing crosses that go past my RB/LB and two CB's (Kaboul/Hummels/Vertonghen) and end up conceding! Kaboul has 19 heading and does not even leave the ground to try and clear the danger, I have noticed this far too often and it is costing me results and patience!

    You can see below the amount of games my players have played and the amount of mistakes they have made (I am not worried about the % leading up to goals, that is not the point, its the amount of mistakes they have made, period) it averages close to two mistakes per game and at the level of football I am playing and the level of my players, and in real life, this should not be happening so often..

    And trust me, I know what I am doing when it comes to player settings/instructions etc..

    Mats Hummels:

    Player mistakes - This is out of hand-mats-hummels_-stats-overview.pngPlayer mistakes - This is out of hand-mats-hummels_-overview-attributes.png

    Jan Vertonghen:

    Player mistakes - This is out of hand-jan-vertonghen_-stats-overview.pngPlayer mistakes - This is out of hand-jan-vertonghen_-overview-attributes.png

    Moussa Dembele:

    Player mistakes - This is out of hand-mousa-demb-l-_-stats-overview.pngPlayer mistakes - This is out of hand-mousa-demb-l-_-overview-attributes.png
    Benniewijs and Darthpootle like this.

  2. Agree with you 100% Raikan. This is an extremely infuriating bug...I hope. Defenders heading the balls out for a corner when under no pressure, keepers that can't hold on to a ball which my 3 year old could have caught, the number of long shots players take when under strict instruction not to, and as you say, crosses which elude the entire back 4 for an opposition player to tap in...all of this happening game after game, not once in a while which is understandable.
    Raikan007 likes this.

  3. I mean, look at those stats, its scary.. you don't see that in real life, Jonny Evans has not made that many mistakes over his whole career at United and he has made a few..

    My defenders do not jump when the balls are crossed in, I have them at CD - Defend..
    DonVilla likes this.

  4. Post Your Frustrations





    (sorry-couldn't resist )
    Last edited by ajt09; 25/01/2013 at 08:42 AM.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by ajt09 View Post
    hahahha, thanks mod ajt this is more than just a frustration though.. I want to see other peoples stats as well..

  6. Honestly can't tell if it is a bug or not-mainly as I haven't come across it as I have a much worse squad (level 8 tier)

  7. Wow, only looked at those stats now. Over 100 mistakes between 3 players and you're only in Jan?! I don't think the whole Villa squad has made that many mistakes this season irl...and thats saying a lot!
    Raikan007, torglenn and serp1 like this.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by ajt09 View Post
    Honestly can't tell if it is a bug or not-mainly as I haven't come across it as I have a much worse squad (level 8 tier)
    check their stats, I would assume it may be worse as you are playing so low down.. if not, post your CB/FB's settings to compare..

  9. FFS! as soon as I posted that, I went into my match and witnessed this... hows that for perfect timing! Jesus! my point exactly..

    uploading video now, will post when ready!

  10. Quote Originally Posted by Raikan007 View Post
    check their stats, I would assume it may be worse as you are playing so low down.. if not, post your CB/FB's settings to compare..
    It is yeah. The key attributes for my CB's are pretty much in the lower black areas, and the heading is woeful. I don't even bother with man marking as the concentration, positioning etc is so poor. I mean yes I did get promoted, but that was due to sticking to 1 formation. I didn't even bother giving pregame instructions for the defenders as it simply wasn't worth it. The mistakes were pretty much all over the pitch which in fairness is to be expected. It was rare that a cross completion of over 10%, and decision making, passing etc was pretty much shocking-and that wasn't down to the pitch. I don't normally pay attention to the important things until I reach somewhere like the Blue Square/Npower League 2. If anything stands out I'll put up some screenies. Will have a look when I get a chance

  11. also just conceded another goal, cross from left hand side, 4 defenders against Naismith (Hummels/Kaboul/Smalling) who are all good in the air.. stood and watched the ball fly straight through them and meet Naismiths head..

    FUCK! (not going to upload that, its quite normal at the moment)

  12. January 2015... So far this season

    Shawcross has played 29 games, made 52 mistakes (none leading to goals)
    Danny Wilson has played 24 games, made 46 mistakes (none leading to goals)
    Joe Allen - 19 starts, 11 sub appearances, 57 mistakes (none leading to goals)

    Overall team - 640 mistakes leading to 3 goals. I'm playing a short passing game at a high tempo so I expect a lot of mistakes, but these numbers surprised me. I'm quite pleased about the recovery from the mistakes however, could be an indication on where the mistakes are happening combined with the recovery of the defenders and a solid GK.

    In the games I do see a lot of these and seem to spend far too often with my head in my hands. I'll look out for specific examples.
    Raikan007 likes this.

  13. In my current season, I have played 47 competive matches WITH A TOP TEAM and here are my stats

    Matches
    : 47
    Conceded goals: 32
    Misstakes: 760 - 16.7/match
    Mistakes leading to a goal: 11 - -0,23/ match
    % of goals conceded that are due to a misstake: 34 %


    Looking at these stats, they seem fine to me

  14. that is quite a few errors as well mate.. I will add up my players mistakes in the next few..

  15. Quote Originally Posted by TheBetterHalf View Post
    In my current season, I have played 47 competive matches WITH A TOP TEAM and here are my stats

    Matches
    : 47
    Conceded goals: 32
    Misstakes: 760 - 16.7/match
    Mistakes leading to a goal: 11 - -0,23/ match
    % of goals conceded that are due to a misstake: 34 %


    Looking at these stats, they seem fine to me
    16.7 errors per game with a top team and that's fine? I doubt the likes of Utd and City etc. make 16.7 errors per game?

  16. So what actually counts as an error? Many of the RL stats are open to interpretation anyway - We've already seen confusion about what is counted as a tackle or interception, for instance.
    TheBetterHalf likes this.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by DonVilla View Post
    16.7 errors per game with a top team and that's fine? I doubt the likes of Utd and City etc. make 16.7 errors per game?
    Naturally. Dont you think that each player makes about 1.5 misstakes every game ?

    It can be of the following reasons.

    Poor back pass - not being aware of where the opposition is, not concentrated enough
    Poorly anticipating a move, running into an offside that easily could have been avoided
    Sliding in a tackle incorrectly, getting ghost passed.
    Coming out to a cross totally wrong
    Scoring an owngoal
    A defender not being aware of his teammates, making my offside trap fail.
    Missing an easy pass going straight into the opponents feet.
    Causing a penalty.
    etc etc
    Last edited by TheBetterHalf; 25/01/2013 at 09:40 AM.
    KaiRooney likes this.

  18. Quote Originally Posted by TheBetterHalf View Post
    Naturally. Dont you think that each player makes about 1.5 misstakes every game ?
    if you average it out, yes they probably do..

    check your strikers/wingers mistakes and compare to that of the defenders..

  19. Quote Originally Posted by TheBetterHalf View Post
    Naturally. Dont you think that each player makes about 1.5 misstakes every game ?
    As fm20 states above, what is classified as an error? Is a missed tackle classified as an error? A poor pass? Missed header? Those things are already counted towards other stats, so I wouldn't think so.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by DonVilla View Post
    As fm20 states above, what is classified as an error? Is a missed tackle classified as an error? A poor pass? Missed header? Those things are already counted towards other stats, so I wouldn't think so.

    It can be of the following reasons.

    Poor back pass - not being aware of where the opposition is, not concentrated enough
    Poorly anticipating a move, running into an offside that easily could have been avoided
    Sliding in a tackle incorrectly, getting ghost passed.
    Coming out to a cross totally wrong ( goalkeeper)
    Scoring an owngoal
    A defender not being aware of his teammates, making my offside trap fail.
    Missing an easy pass going straight into the opponents feet.
    Causing a penalty.
    etc etc

  21. Quote Originally Posted by TheBetterHalf View Post
    It can be of the following reasons.

    Poor back pass - not being aware of where the opposition is, not concentrated enough
    Poorly anticipating a move, running into an offside that easily could have been avoided
    Sliding in a tackle incorrectly, getting ghost passed.
    Coming out to a cross totally wrong ( goalkeeper)
    Scoring an owngoal
    A defender not being aware of his teammates, making my offside trap fail.
    Missing an easy pass going straight into the opponents feet.
    Causing a penalty.
    etc etc
    Ok, in those cases I could see 1.5 errors per player per game.
    Would be beneficial if we had errors leading to a goal scoring opportunity stat?

  22. Here is the video as mentioned earlier

    Here is exactly what I am referring too.. it happens all too often!



    1) Hugo's communication stat is 12 (which is not the greatest nor not the worst)
    2) Hummels and Hugo can speak English, so communication is not the issue between them

    So that could be the only real reason why this could have happened.. and lets not forget about Hugo's throw straight to the opposition

  23. Quote Originally Posted by DonVilla View Post
    Ok, in those cases I could see 1.5 errors per player per game.
    Would be beneficial if we had errors leading to a goal scoring opportunity stat?

    You have those in the game to. Just use the customized view, click the + and then scroll down to stats and then look for it and add that column.

    I use a costumized view when picking my team and when looking at the misstakes made, Its clear that its my young players, inconsistant players ( found in the staff report) and/or players lacking in concentration, anticipation that makes the most misstakes per position ( one DMC compared to anoyther DMC etc). This is something I look for when picking a team for a big match, I make sure that I dont fiedld a team that cant cope with the pressure etc, a team where I dont have too many inconsistant players.
    Last edited by TheBetterHalf; 25/01/2013 at 09:51 AM.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by TheBetterHalf View Post
    You have those in the game to. Just use the customized view, click the + and then scroll down to stats and then look for it and add that column.

    Brilliant! Thanks for that, will definitely be using it.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by DonVilla View Post
    Brilliant! Thanks for that, will definitely be using it.
    I have edited my post above
    DonVilla likes this.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by TheBetterHalf View Post
    You have those in the game to. Just use the customized view, click the + and then scroll down to stats and then look for it and add that column.

    I use a costumized view when picking my team and when looking at the misstakes made, Its clear that its my young players, inconsistant players ( found in the staff report) and/or players lacking in concentration, anticipation that makes the most misstakes per position ( one DMC compared to anoyther DMC etc). This is something I look for when picking a team for a big match, I make sure that I dont fiedld a team that cant cope with the pressure etc, a team where I dont have too many inconsistant players.
    I too do this when picking a team, as well as looking at players work rates and important match stats.

  27. One mistake that keeps re-occurring for me, is my goalkeeper dribbling the ball out to around 30-40 yards (For no real reason) and kicking it straight to a opposition player, who vollys it in from 40-50 yard. so frustrating seeing that almost every other game.

    Ive change all the keepers instructions too, Defender collects, play to DL, DR, same results...
    Raikan007 likes this.

  28. here is another one that just happened to me God I love FM13 at the moment!

  29. hows this for a comedy of errors....

    Player mistakes - This is out of hand-neil-edward-patrick-hart_-news-inbox.png

  30. lazlow's Avatar lazlow
    Backup
    The thing im not impressed with right now is how stupidly random the game is, now im no fan of re loading games if i ever do it its to test a tactical tweak on a seperate save to my main save and i always accept the first result but curiosity sometimes gets the better of me and i think hmm i wonder what would have happend if id done this or that etc.

    So i just played spurs 4 times and the scores were 4-1,3-1,2-0,1-1 so from 4 games i went from hammering them 4-1 to losing 2 games and drawing one , and mistakes cost me on both losses its almost as if the games rolling an rng dice to determine who will win with a small amount of consideration taken in to count rep and player stats.Frustrating much.

  31. Quote Originally Posted by lazlow View Post
    The thing im not impressed with right now is how stupidly random the game is, now im no fan of re loading games if i ever do it its to test a tactical tweak on a seperate save to my main save and i always accept the first result but curiosity sometimes gets the better of me and i think hmm i wonder what would have happend if id done this or that etc.

    So i just played spurs 4 times and the scores were 4-1,3-1,2-0,1-1 so from 4 games i went from hammering them 4-1 to losing 2 games and drawing one , and mistakes cost me on both losses its almost as if the games rolling an rng dice to determine who will win with a small amount of consideration taken in to count rep and player stats.Frustrating much.
    The trick is not to replay matches. Here, you are basically constructing parallel universes and this cant be compared to real life as we would never ever know what happends in those

  32. I have lost hope in this game. It is not fun anymore. I will go back to fm12 and load a transfer update and play there. I have run into this bug too many times to count. The first couple times it was with jack Robinson, and I figured ok he's young that is going to happen. When it happend three four and five times in one season, I just can't put more time into this game. I start a man united save thinking I'll just play a less challenging save. Same things happen, I run the might and magic tactics and I'm at mid table through December. I buy Fellini and Gareth bale!!! An yet still only a mid table team with man utd through December using tried and texted tactics. I've been playing this game since 2009, I know or atleast I used to know how to play this game. Now it's just a way for me to spend time getting angry because its so flawed!!!

  33. Thread Closed for a while as it has startd to go off topic. This one is supposed to be about the misstakes made in the game by players.

    If you have other issues with the game, then either use the frustration thread to vent, or use the feedback thread for the 13.2 patch for ME issues or the 13.2.2 for crash issues

    Cheers

  34. been really suffering at the moment on my save.. its really making it difficult to enjoy the game at the moment.. I have now switched to 2D as well...

    I have conceded 5 goals in 5 games due to mistakes.. and all of them have cost me points! playing as QPR and started 9 games in the season (as real to life as possible) with them sitting on 1 win.. so had an uphill battle already..

    this is just making it worse!

    thread open!

  35. another mistake has just cost me a point.. was 2:2 with Chelsea and Cesar scored an own goal! jesus christ! fuck!

  36. This is what bugs me to a degree, i'll post about legitimate errors with the game e.g still conceding in the last 5 minutes regularly due to ridiculous goals (i think i'm up to 30 separate games screenshotted over 2 seasons) and I just get bashed for my tactics, players, settings, etc then it's made out I have a attitude problem or something. If I could have made a montage of every ''last 5 minutes'' goal you'd understand my true frustration.

    My 2 first choice CB's and GK have made a combined 87 mistakes by Jan 2nd, and if you include my first choice LB/RB that's another 66 mistakes. That's 153 mistakes in 6 months by my defence and GK. Crazy. You could argue that I've recently been back to back promoted from Blue Sq > Prem so the player quality is lower however I'm mid table in the prem. Even with my usual Spurs save I start every year my team was insane by 2017 and a similar thing was happening, just I scored more goals to ''cover'' the mistakes. My backup RB has played 14 games, few of them sub appearances and made 21 mistakes. My back up RB has played 7 games, couple of them sub appearances and made 15 mistakes. Seems high to me. My main DMC's ignoring regens have made their fair share of mistakes too (Lars Bender on Loan - 39 mistakes in 22 games, Lorenzo Crisetig 22 mistakes in 12 games and Lorik Cana 33 mistakes in 21 games)

  37. and now im sure ill stick to fm12

  38. I might be wrong but things seem a lot better to me playing in 2d

  39. Quote Originally Posted by Trinity4eva View Post
    I might be wrong but things seem a lot better to me playing in 2d
    it does seem like that mate my GPU was giving problems last week so I took it out and now just using onboard and using 2D as well

    the mistakes are still there mate, trust me, you just cannot physically see them..
    Scotty98TR likes this.

  40. The only one that particularly bothers me is when the might whole team just watches a cross straight across the goal line for the opposition to tap it in (And I am West Ham at the moment, and have bought 2 strong, tall centre backs due to my deep line!
    Raikan007 likes this.

  41. I cannot see whats wrong with the amount of mistakes :/ my best player is in feb and he has 47 mistakes neymar whos my second best player only has 23 but he has played less also. it must be misplaced passes causing a large amount of them.

    edit: certain postions tend to be me prone to more mistakes, AMC and CB espesh
    Last edited by InValide jr; 06/02/2013 at 06:32 PM.

  42. Mike.'s Avatar Mike.
    Super Moderator
    Quote Originally Posted by DonVilla View Post
    Ok, in those cases I could see 1.5 errors per player per game.
    Would be beneficial if we had errors leading to a goal scoring opportunity stat?
    Any action that has a result that is detrimental to the team could be classed as a mistake. So its what Thebetterhalf said and more. I will PM PaulC to get an exact definition but really the number of mistakes if anything are too low, especially in terms of passing

  43. The most regular bizarre mistake I seem to find with my team is my keeper throwing out a short throw/short pass to my full back, missing the full back my miles and the opposition picking the ball up and getting a quick counter attack chance. Seems to happen every game, they don't always score but when they do it really grinds my gears!
    Raikan007 likes this.

  44. Mike.'s Avatar Mike.
    Super Moderator
    Quote Originally Posted by Bowieinspace26 View Post
    The most regular bizarre mistake I seem to find with my team is my keeper throwing out a short throw/short pass to my full back, missing the full back my miles and the opposition picking the ball up and getting a quick counter attack chance. Seems to happen every game, they don't always score but when they do it really grinds my gears!
    Sounds like a bug rather than a player mistake

  45. Quote Originally Posted by Mike. View Post
    Sounds like a bug rather than a player mistake
    check the video of mine on the first page, this happens far too often.. happened twice in 6 games for me with QPR

  46. Quote Originally Posted by Scotty98TR View Post
    The only one that particularly bothers me is when the might whole team just watches a cross straight across the goal line for the opposition to tap it in (And I am West Ham at the moment, and have bought 2 strong, tall centre backs due to my deep line!
    this happens all the time mate.. I had Kaboul at like 19 heading and 17 jumping and he is a statue...

    same thing happening with Samba now..

  47. I'm currently reading a book called soccernomics. It's about the use of in-depth statistics in soccer. In the book there is a quote that is something like that:

    "A team that makes mistakes on no more than 15-18% of their actions is unbeatable".

    Depending on what the ME calls a "mistake", I think we're being a little too demanding on how many mistakes we expect players to make. If an unbeatable team makes less than 20% of their actions as mistakes, how many does the average side make? My guess is 25% or more.
    Raikan007 likes this.

  48. Mistakes check out Huddlestone & Santon, both tracking at more than 2 a game.
    Player mistakes - This is out of hand-2013-02-14_00001.jpgPlayer mistakes - This is out of hand-2013-02-14_00002.jpg
    Mind you huddlestone is average but santon has basically been my best player.

  49. Mike.'s Avatar Mike.
    Super Moderator
    People underestimate how many mistakes there actually are in a game of football. Forget MOTD, carefully watch your next few matches with the express purpose of looking for mistakes. Actually slightly too few in FM

  50. Quote Originally Posted by Mike. View Post
    People underestimate how many mistakes there actually are in a game of football. Forget MOTD, carefully watch your next few matches with the express purpose of looking for mistakes. Actually slightly too few in FM
    I totally agree with this.

    I'm not sure if there have been bugs (I've seen a few common mistakes that lead to goals that are very frustrating, such as poor 'keeper distribution and players not clearing the ball) but this does happen a fair bit in football anyway. Perhaps those more error prone players need to be given less creative freedom? But it seems that mistakes are more readily punished on FM
    Raikan007 likes this.

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