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Arrigo Sacchi's 4-4-2 Tweaks Thread
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  1. Quote Originally Posted by champion7891 View Post
    Hi.

    I was thinking, could we tweak the original tactic by having player swap positions? Like CF swap with AF, WML swaps with WMR, DML swaps with DMR? Makes it much harder to mark and for wingers with cutting inside PPM it would be good.

    Thoughts?
    give it a go let us know how you get on

  2. Quote Originally Posted by kitchin75 View Post
    give it a go let us know how you get on
    Sure will do, just wanted speculation. IMO it should work as the basis of the tactic is to have versatile players rather than specialists. Conversely, since the philosophy is very fluid, it might cause problems (too very fluid lol).


    Btw, I am right in thinking that a player like Lukaku is more a fit for CF, and Jovetic for AF?

  3. Quote Originally Posted by champion7891 View Post
    Sure will do, just wanted speculation. IMO it should work as the basis of the tactic is to have versatile players rather than specialists. Conversely, since the philosophy is very fluid, it might cause problems (too very fluid lol).


    Btw, I am right in thinking that a player like Lukaku is more a fit for CF, and Jovetic for AF?
    i think lukaku should work at cf

  4. Quote Originally Posted by herne79 View Post
    The wingless 4-2-3-1 Tweak

    Tactic link attached below.

    The basic formation is:
    Attachment 328637

    I've been playing this as Real Madrid with amazing results.

    The tweak is fairly simple - attacking formation changed to 2 attacking midfielders (attack duty) in the AMCL/R positions, with an Advanced Playmaker (support) in between and a Deep Lying Forward (attack) ahead.

    The mentality is also tweaked - I play "control" away from home and "attacking" at home. It may be possible to just play "attacking" as per the original, however I seemed to get better results with the duel set up. Both tactics are attached.

    The AP links up well with the defensive formation, with the three designated attackers all working as a cohesive unit.

    Team width is slightly wider than seanhrfc's original, plus the AP is ticked as the playmaker.

    The 2 AMCs should ideally have decent stats for Finishing, Acceleration, Dribbling, Passing along with good techincal & mental attributes. Retraining strikers or wingers would also work well. I've been playing Ronaldo and Di Maria in these two roles and they have been outstanding.

    NOTE - if you can, play a right footed player as AMCL and a left footed player as AMCR.

    The AP is your primary flair player, needing lots of creativity. Finishing is not so important.


    Results

    For the first half of a new season: P36 W35 D1 L0 For 135 Against 15.
    Attachment 328638
    Hi Herne, I imagine you probably don't play fm13 anymore, the post you wrote here is 1 year old, though pretty new too me
    I just started using this formation for my Barcelona team, I believe its perfect for it. I have the sort of AMC's you are talking about, I actually usually use them in the CM position, but they are natural AMC's I just love these sort of players, quick,creative,technically gifted think Maradona - Messi etc. and great at finishing,dribling, I have many of these training complete forward training and trequartista training, so perfect tactic for my team I'm sure. I also like this sort of formation alot if I was in charge of a real club I would probably use a tactic like this, one thing though that puzzles me a little is what sort of striker do you use, a striker thats good at a certain thing like strong and jump/heading or creative and fast or just a general striker thats a little bit good but no star or speciality. Well since the striker is a deep laying striker I would say a very creative striker would be optimal, but that ofcourse makes me a bit sad because of all the incredible strikers I have who are less creative so I have to decide what I do ?

    Since this tactic gets you possession I would say a strong striker who is capable of finishing,jumping/heading is not a bad solution for the crosses, I don't please give me your thoughts.

    cheers

  5. I found herne tweaked tactic effective but with 3 simple tweaks is awesome ( I checked with R.Madrid,Dinamo Zagreb and at this movent with Newcastle ).

    The template is herne tweak but with no striker, AP in an offensive dutty and one more CM played like the other two CM all of them in support dutty.

    AP is the "cerebro" and the target man also. With 3 CM in defense can help the full backs and in offense can break defense with the 3 of the front.

    And the 3 of the front ( the 2 AMC and the AP ) are funny to watch in action.

  6. Hi Guys,
    I've been using the original tactic on most my save games with great success. I'm now in a position where I can over power most of my opposition with attacking players like Falcao, Nem, Moura, Garmash and a few notable other high quality players. Which of the tweaks does the group advise for a more attacking tweak? Any help on this would be much appreciated!

  7. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    I found herne tweaked tactic effective but with 3 simple tweaks is awesome ( I checked with R.Madrid,Dinamo Zagreb and at this movent with Newcastle ).

    The template is herne tweak but with no striker, AP in an offensive dutty and one more CM played like the other two CM all of them in support dutty.

    AP is the "cerebro" and the target man also. With 3 CM in defense can help the full backs and in offense can break defense with the 3 of the front.

    And the 3 of the front ( the 2 AMC and the AP ) are funny to watch in action.
    Here is "my" tweaked tactic. Like I said before is herne with a little changes.
    Attached Files

  8. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    I found herne tweaked tactic effective but with 3 simple tweaks is awesome ( I checked with R.Madrid,Dinamo Zagreb and at this movent with Newcastle ).

    The template is herne tweak but with no striker, AP in an offensive dutty and one more CM played like the other two CM all of them in support dutty.

    AP is the "cerebro" and the target man also. With 3 CM in defense can help the full backs and in offense can break defense with the 3 of the front.

    And the 3 of the front ( the 2 AMC and the AP ) are funny to watch in action.
    Could you post a results screenshot? Like how you did over a season's fixtures and the overall league table?

  9. Quote Originally Posted by champion7891 View Post
    Could you post a results screenshot? Like how you did over a season's fixtures and the overall league table?
    The league table and some results. Hope it can help. Dont have time for make it better
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Arrigo Sacchi's 4-4-2 Tweaks Thread-jj.png   Arrigo Sacchi's 4-4-2 Tweaks Thread-jhjk.png  
    jesaustralia likes this.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    The league table and some results. Hope it can help. Dont have time for make it better
    dude that is so awesome...just a couple of questions:

    what type of players you use in each poisiton? For e.g does your AP need to be an AM or can he be a retrained striker?

  11. Quote Originally Posted by champion7891 View Post
    dude that is so awesome...just a couple of questions:

    what type of players you use in each poisiton? For e.g does your AP need to be an AM or can he be a retrained striker?
    For the 3 of the front : The AMC can be retrained strikers with no problem ( much better if right footed is on the left and left footed on the rigth ) but for the AP ( the key player ) have to use a very creativity player with good pass,determination and good finish too. The AP in this tactic is like a False 9 : assist and score. If you have a striker with creativity and pass you can use him of course.

    For the 3 CM need players type box to box,with good pass and defense . For the CBs : well I use ball players but you can change it to a normal defender is your CBs dont have enought pass. For the rest of playes,FB and GK ,normal ones can fix this tactic very well.

    I know my save is with Real Madrid,but this tactic is based on the tweaked one of Herne,and can fix with underdogs and midtable too,maybe not with the same results,but its funny to see too. ( Sorry for my english )
    Last edited by bwomper; 02/07/2014 at 12:08 AM.
    jesaustralia likes this.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    Here is "my" tweaked tactic. Like I said before is herne with a little changes.
    Lol, I actually a tactic just like that. I didn't think someone else would make the same formation tactic. I'd say that formation is effective!
    bwomper likes this.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    For the 3 of the front : The AMC can be retrained strikers with no problem ( much better if right footed is on the left and left footed on the rigth ) but for the AP ( the key player ) have to use a very creativity player with good pass,determination and good finish too. The AP in this tactic is like a False 9 : assist and score. If you have a striker with creativity and pass you can use him of course.

    For the 3 CM need players type box to box,with good pass and defense . For the CBs : well I use ball players but you can change it to a normal defender is your CBs dont have enought pass. For the rest of playes,FB and GK ,normal ones can fix this tactic very well.

    I know my save is with Real Madrid,but this tactic is based on the tweaked one of Herne,and can fix with underdogs and midtable too,maybe not with the same results,but its funny to see too. ( Sorry for my english )
    It is an awesome tactic Bwomper, ofcourse it doesn't look very appealing when you look at the tactic overview NO strikers, but if you can ignore that - I can! and follow the very simple instructions you gave above this tactic can get you alot of enjoyment.

    I had a few weeks without any games for my Middlesbrough team in february and decided lets change from the Arrigo Sacchi
    4-4-2 to this one, what it meant was I had to retrain all my strikers to AM's not a problem I do that and in time they will become killer strikers in an AM position, it also meant that my very talented wingers became next to useless, so I decided to retrain them as well to become AM's I already had myself covered in the DMC area with 6 midfielders so no problem their.

    Here's the outcome not being fluid in this tactic - Liga cup final vs Southampton
    Arrigo Sacchi's 4-4-2 Tweaks Thread-middlesbrough-v-southampton_-overview-overview.png

    I absolutely love your tweak and agree with champ that this is awesome, so well done on thinking outside the box. It must be a strong candidate for the best FM13 tactic out their.

    Just one note about Your AMC its not required to have a high passer an average one will do just fine 10+ but what is important is probably his creativity and decision making. Rule of thumb is: Settings set to more direct needs better passing score, this guy is set to the middle so an average passer will do just fine, as long as he is creative and make good decision's. the same actually goes for the 3 DM's who have the same passing setting. The 2 other AMC's Amcl/r though have it set to more direct which indicates that they could benefit from high passing skills along with decisions and creativity. I just thought I would put it out their becourse I feel that often their is a misunderstanding towards passing. I also wanna say about the amcl/r probably don't need need the high passing skill becourse they are already far up the pitch and pretty closse to each other but ofcourse it can never hurt

    Great tactic can't wait to use more with my Middlesbrough team

    Cheers!
    bwomper likes this.

  14. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    For the 3 of the front : The AMC can be retrained strikers with no problem ( much better if right footed is on the left and left footed on the rigth ) but for the AP ( the key player ) have to use a very creativity player with good pass,determination and good finish too. The AP in this tactic is like a False 9 : assist and score. If you have a striker with creativity and pass you can use him of course.

    For the 3 CM need players type box to box,with good pass and defense . For the CBs : well I use ball players but you can change it to a normal defender is your CBs dont have enought pass. For the rest of playes,FB and GK ,normal ones can fix this tactic very well.

    I know my save is with Real Madrid,but this tactic is based on the tweaked one of Herne,and can fix with underdogs and midtable too,maybe not with the same results,but its funny to see too. ( Sorry for my english )
    This is a great tactic. I have used it with a weak team (Celta) and finished 6th in La liga (had a couple of really great loan signing though). The front 3 are brilliant. The way the AMC drops and creates space, they way the rest of the AMs move into channels its beautiful.

    1 thing that I would like to see (i dont knowif its possible) is high pressing. I want the front 3 to really press defenders. They don;t really track back and ive yet to see players in AM or ST track back, but they should be made to press high up.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by champion7891 View Post
    This is a great tactic. I have used it with a weak team (Celta) and finished 6th in La liga (had a couple of really great loan signing though). The front 3 are brilliant. The way the AMC drops and creates space, they way the rest of the AMs move into channels its beautiful.

    1 thing that I would like to see (i dont knowif its possible) is high pressing. I want the front 3 to really press defenders. They don;t really track back and ive yet to see players in AM or ST track back, but they should be made to press high up.
    I tried to push up the press but with no good results,if someone want try is free to do it.

    I still using this tactic and is so beautifull to see

  16. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    I tried to push up the press but with no good results,if someone want try is free to do it.

    I still using this tactic and is so beautifull to see
    What tactic

  17. Quote Originally Posted by nas2439 View Post
    What tactic
    my 4-3-3-0 tweak

    4-3-3 Vicen (1).tac

  18. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    my 4-3-3-0 tweak

    Attachment 671473
    Hi, could you tell me if you use attacking movement training or the default arrigo sacchi tactics defensive positioning?

  19. Quote Originally Posted by champion7891 View Post
    Hi, could you tell me if you use attacking movement training or the default arrigo sacchi tactics defensive positioning?
    the default setting works fine with me.

    For the press "problem" in some games i use "overload" instead of "ofensive" and I see a little more preassure by the 3 of the front.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by bwomper View Post
    the default setting works fine with me.

    For the press "problem" in some games i use "overload" instead of "ofensive" and I see a little more preassure by the 3 of the front.
    Thanks. For my fledgling team i found that I had great result defensively (30 clean sheet and the least goals conceded) but offensively lacked a bit finishing 2nd in my third season with Celta thats why I was asking.

  21. Spurs team 1st season is pretty much ready made for that tactic.

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